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Alex's avatar
Feb 16Edited

Does this argument also apply to, say, Russia, or Iran? What about historical examples of other autocratic states with economic success, like Chile under Pinochet? Or even Saddam's Iraq, which was a modestly economically successful state?

Many of the comments you make here also apply to those states. Ceasing the ideological counteroffensive against those states would probably make engagement easier. It might make it easier to predict what those states will do next. It might make it easier to co-operate in some regards with those states.

If the argument doesn't apply to Russia, Iran, or Pinochet's Chile, why not?

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THOMAS REINHART's avatar

I agree that legitimacy by elections isn't a universal principle; in history, some of the very worst governments have been elected by majorities. European fascists, African "big men" or Latin American caudillos all have won majorities - and now we have the US following the same path. I also agree that diplomacy can't achieve much if one side considers the other a priori illegitimate.

But I disagree that there are no universal values at all. To me, rights of the individual are paramount. That's the idea that every human as such has rights, independent of belonging to any group of religion, race, party affiliation, belonging to a "disadvantaged" group or whatever. The test for any government is whether an individual can defend those rights in independent courts, even against the state himself. That is now the last line of defence in the US against creeping authoritarianism, and it is also the point where China fails the test. It's also the reason why Chinese people like moving some of their assets (and their families) into countries where such individual rights are respected. In that sense, the Chinese government indeed does lack some legitimacy in the eyes of its own citizens.

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